The Wing Forum
DISCUSSIONS => WINGFOIL => Topic started by: PedroMarcos on March 30, 2020, 08:25:06 pm
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So, any feedback on wind wings for light air? Does anyone know how a 7m Airrush compares to a 6m Ensis, a 5.5 Armstrong A-Wing, a 7m Echo, a 6m Unit; or a 6.4 Slingshot V2?
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This is a good review that compares the Naish s25 5.3m wing and the Ozone Wasp 5m wing - out of the two the f-one very similar to the Wasp in that it is very light weight, has a very stiff shape, and excels in low end power.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DutQgDRV4Ic
Also, here's a review of the 6m s25. It's 56 minutes long :o so that might be a bit much, but if you've got time on your hands at the moment it's worth a watch as he gives some really good advise on light wing pumping technique as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_WPqAMTDgw
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Good stuff ... had seen the first one ... 2nd is great ... I have only tried the slingwing 4.2 in not enough wind ... looking for options as I do not like drifting downwind. I would love to have know the windspeed for the 2nd ... looked very light and almost drifting at some of the vid.
Thanks!
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Hew somebody test gong 9m2 what its posibel with 9m2 its to big for light wind pleas um answer
Hi Davor
Are you referring to the Gong superpower 9m? I've been keeping an eye out for reviews of that as I'm interested to know how it handles as well, but so far I've only seen a few reviews for the 6m. I have a Gong wing plus 7m and find it really good - but have never tried any wing of similar size to make a comparison. Its great in 9-15 knots, but I suppose it depends a lot on your weight - I'm 85kg and quite tall. I've used it when it's been gusting between 15 and nearly 19 knots and although it wasn't the most comfortable, i could handle it fine and never felt out of control. As long as it's averaging 10 knots it doesn't matter if it drops down to 8 knots occasionally, BUT if it stays at 8knots consistently (or drops lower) it is hard to get up on foil, and it feels really heavy as it isn't supported by the wind so well. Also, as it's BIG, you always have to be aware to make sure the wing tip doesn't catch the water. My worries about a 9m are that the extra weight will limit it's light wind performance - I might get going in 8 knots, but will it feel like a lump in my hands? Also will it catch in the water more? Personally I think the 9m might be targeted at heavier riders who need more than a 6 or 7m to get going in the same wind range as lighter riders.
Having said that, if people say it gets them good sessions in 6 knots + then i'm in!!!! We have so many light wind days where I am that extending my wind range to the 6-10 knot range would give me sooooo much more time on the water.
I'd be VERY interested to hear if anyone has used the Gong 9m and what they think of it.
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Interesting discussion and thanks for the input ... I guess I'm wondering as much about the wing choices as the board choices.
Differences between the brands - power and ease of use. Light weight and smooth power trading gust handling / upwind ability vs upwind and rigid. For instance: how does the F-one compare to the Naish S25 or the Wasp or the Slingwing in handling / power / upwind. I have only played with my 4.2 Slingwing but I am looking for a 6.0 and too many choices / no options around here to try before hitting the buy button.
Maybe this should be in a different thread? I can restate in the nub question threat or admin could move.
Tnx, Mac
This is a good review that compares the Naish s25 5.3m wing and the Ozone Wasp 5m wing - out of the two the f-one very similar to the Wasp in that it is very light weight, has a very stiff shape, and excels in low end power.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DutQgDRV4Ic
Also, here's a review of the 6m s25. It's 56 minutes long :o so that might be a bit much, but if you've got time on your hands at the moment it's worth a watch as he gives some really good advise on light wing pumping technique as well.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c_WPqAMTDgw
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Interesting discussion and thanks for the input ... I guess I'm wondering as much about the wing choices as the board choices.
Differences between the brands - power and ease of use. Light weight and smooth power trading gust handling / upwind ability vs upwind and rigid. For instance: how does the F-one compare to the Naish S25 or the Wasp or the Slingwing in handling / power / upwind. I have only played with my 4.2 Slingwing but I am looking for a 6.0 and too many choices / no options around here to try before hitting the buy button.
Maybe this should be in a different thread? I can restate in the nub question threat or admin could move.
Tnx, Mac
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Hew somebody test gong 9m2 what its posibel with 9m2 its to big for light wind pleas um answer
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In San Francisco Bay I’m using Naish 95L Hover w/ 2450 wing, 75cm mast and 6.0 wing-surfer. 10-15 knots is minimum to get up on foil. Wind needs to average at least 12 knots. If lulls go below 10 then I can’t keep the board flying on foil above the water surface. 12-15 knots is the sweet spot for this setup. I’m not really into pumping the board up onto foil yet.
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/71311095_10157780962078615_8318906934258302976_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_sid=dd7718&_nc_ohc=ZHkYq5TgmCAAX8gKrzN&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=fdbe49c212b84a5507cbd91a0287d149&oe=5EA8D444)
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69872700_3625734737452655_4126652617206005760_o.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=6S6y02lIs9IAX9EyKvC&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=f692558a3a75150af604d2c73b320ae5&oe=5EA8C165)
Hi Gunnar
If you find those big raceboards better than SUP foil boards for light wind foiling would you ever consider designing a SUP foil specific board based on those designs?
Yes.
I do have a old Mikes Lab board just like that temavento one here at home, your track box seems to be quite on the back of the board, its that the windsurf fuse? What distance from the back you installed the tracks in the board? Assuming you will use the kite fuselage for onda.
Thanks
There are no tracks in that board. I use it as is with the Windfoil Fuselage with the Tuttle Mast in the Tuttle box of the board. Like I said in the post above. The Windfoil setup gets going faster and goes upwind better in light wind.
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/71311095_10157780962078615_8318906934258302976_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_sid=dd7718&_nc_ohc=ZHkYq5TgmCAAX8gKrzN&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=fdbe49c212b84a5507cbd91a0287d149&oe=5EA8D444)
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69872700_3625734737452655_4126652617206005760_o.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=6S6y02lIs9IAX9EyKvC&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=f692558a3a75150af604d2c73b320ae5&oe=5EA8C165)
Hi Gunnar
If you find those big raceboards better than SUP foil boards for light wind foiling would you ever consider designing a SUP foil specific board based on those designs?
Yes.
I do have a old Mikes Lab board just like that temavento one here at home, your track box seems to be quite on the back of the board, its that the windsurf fuse? What distance from the back you installed the tracks in the board? Assuming you will use the kite fuselage for onda.
Thanks
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/71311095_10157780962078615_8318906934258302976_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_sid=dd7718&_nc_ohc=ZHkYq5TgmCAAX8gKrzN&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=fdbe49c212b84a5507cbd91a0287d149&oe=5EA8D444)
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69872700_3625734737452655_4126652617206005760_o.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=6S6y02lIs9IAX9EyKvC&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=f692558a3a75150af604d2c73b320ae5&oe=5EA8C165)
Hi Gunnar
If you find those big raceboards better than SUP foil boards for light wind foiling would you ever consider designing a SUP foil specific board based on those designs?
Yes.
Cool. When you have one ready let us know ;D ;D ;D ;D
Do you think it would be good for downwinding with a wing and/or a paddle?
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/71311095_10157780962078615_8318906934258302976_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_sid=dd7718&_nc_ohc=ZHkYq5TgmCAAX8gKrzN&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=fdbe49c212b84a5507cbd91a0287d149&oe=5EA8D444)
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69872700_3625734737452655_4126652617206005760_o.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=6S6y02lIs9IAX9EyKvC&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=f692558a3a75150af604d2c73b320ae5&oe=5EA8C165)
Hi Gunnar
If you find those big raceboards better than SUP foil boards for light wind foiling would you ever consider designing a SUP foil specific board based on those designs?
Yes.
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/71311095_10157780962078615_8318906934258302976_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_sid=dd7718&_nc_ohc=ZHkYq5TgmCAAX8gKrzN&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=fdbe49c212b84a5507cbd91a0287d149&oe=5EA8D444)
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69872700_3625734737452655_4126652617206005760_o.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=6S6y02lIs9IAX9EyKvC&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=f692558a3a75150af604d2c73b320ae5&oe=5EA8C165)
Hi Gunnar
If you find those big raceboards better than SUP foil boards for light wind foiling would you ever consider designing a SUP foil specific board based on those designs?
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Love this debate - all info shared is really interesting, and am happy to share my (limited) experiences if it helps anyone. I have a 7m Gong wing plus and a Naish Hover 6'5 125ltr SUP foil board. I can relate to just about every comment that's been made so far. What I can say from my own experiences is that technique makes a HUGE difference, and the more experience you get the better your technique will get. Sounds obvious but everything in foiling seems totally impossible the first time (or few times) I try something new, and suddenly after persevering a while, it clicks. It's a case of, you can't until you can! Where I live at the moment (Oman) it's 90% 8-12 knots. The first few months I only had a 4m Takuma wing ride and had no chance. Then I got the 7m Gong and could get going in 10-12 knots, then with practice, 9-11 knots, and finally I've managed to break into 8-10 knots, although I agree that unless the wind is gusting more at the 10 knot end rather than at 8 knots, it's a lot of effort to keep going while holding such a big wing. I've just ordered a custom Jimmy Lewis board (5'9 by 29") which is super light and based on his 'Flying V' design which is supposed to be a machine at catching small waves and swell - can't wait... but I'm going to have to because you've probably guessed it, I can't get it to me until the flight restrictions have lifted :( ;D
Keep persevering - it gets easier!
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Hi,
For me the question is will this be a fun session?
When I first got my gong 7m I went out in light wind several times. I found that sitting there holding up a big heavy kite during the lulls wasn't very fun, and trying to fly back on my weak side was brutal hard work.
So now I'm only into light wind if the kite is big and ultralight weight. The f-one 6m is light and feels nimble, and yet I will only pump up if there are gusts above 15.
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
https://www.facebook.com/kitechino/videos/528727078021999/
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Gunnar
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
I use old Mikes Lab and Temavento KiteRaceboards. I use my big Windfoils on it.
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/71311095_10157780962078615_8318906934258302976_o.jpg?_nc_cat=111&_nc_sid=dd7718&_nc_ohc=ZHkYq5TgmCAAX8gKrzN&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=fdbe49c212b84a5507cbd91a0287d149&oe=5EA8D444)
(https://scontent-mad1-1.xx.fbcdn.net/v/t1.0-9/69872700_3625734737452655_4126652617206005760_o.jpg?_nc_cat=110&_nc_sid=8024bb&_nc_ohc=6S6y02lIs9IAX9EyKvC&_nc_ht=scontent-mad1-1.xx&oh=f692558a3a75150af604d2c73b320ae5&oe=5EA8C165)
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Gunnar, could you share details about the board you use for the really light wind days?
I am also interested in going in the lightest winds possible.
Thanks
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I have seen this light wind debate in wind foiling and one thing I noticed is it seems not all wind is the same.
Perhaps this has to do with wind meters not always being accurate depending on wind direction, or maybe land features speeding up the wind on the water, or slowing it down at the wind meter.
At some location kites will fly at a wind speed where other locations they will drop.
So, when you say you want to Wing Foil in 5 or 6 knots, I believe at some locations that is possible, at other locations it is not, and it might have to do with the way the wind meter reports the wind, or the chop on the water, or how steady the wind is, or something else.
At my location once the gust is under 10 knots no ones goes out. In a 12 knot gust my Swing 6 works on a large Infinity 84 foil. In an 11 knot gust it might work with a lot of pumping. Keep in mind these are the gusts, not the average.
I agree with you. It varies a lot on how people gage the wing. However after 20 years of kiting and also racing in those super light conditions I know what 6 knots feels like on the water. But you are right, most people will not be out with wing in those conditions under 10 knots, but I am not everyone. I am the guy who will kill himself trying to make it work, even if it means pumping until my arms give out. This results in my usually being to only guy out when the other are on the beach taking bets if I will get it to work or not. Also I do keep mentioning, that I am on specialised board setups for that wind. You will not get going with your standard SUPfoil board and especially not on a board with massive concaves under the nose.
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Gunnar
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I have seen this light wind debate in wind foiling and one thing I noticed is it seems not all wind is the same.
Perhaps this has to do with wind meters not always being accurate depending on wind direction, or maybe land features speeding up the wind on the water, or slowing it down at the wind meter.
At some location kites will fly at a wind speed where other locations they will drop.
So, when you say you want to Wing Foil in 5 or 6 knots, I believe at some locations that is possible, at other locations it is not, and it might have to do with the way the wind meter reports the wind, or the chop on the water, or how steady the wind is, or something else.
At my location once the gust is under 10 knots no ones goes out. In a 12 knot gust my Swing 6 works on a large Infinity 84 foil. In an 11 knot gust it might work with a lot of pumping. Keep in mind these are the gusts, not the average.
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With a 6m S-wing, Axis 1000 foil at 73kg I can ride in 6-8 knots. The wind is never steady so I just wait for a small puff then pump hard to get up on foil. Once up you generate apparent wind and can stay going through the lulls pumping the board and the foil. I would only choose the wing over the kitefoil in light winds if it’s offshore conditions. Then there will always be a gust to catch. You just gotta wait for it. I can’t match the windfoilers who are on much bigger boards and 9m sails, but I can get close.
That's encouraging. I have a 6 meter Naish S25 but find it difficult to avoid hitting water until I can stand. Of course, it is hard to stand as a beginner in light winds. I am 70 kg and average height.
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With a 6m S-wing, Axis 1000 foil at 73kg I can ride in 6-8 knots. The wind is never steady so I just wait for a small puff then pump hard to get up on foil. Once up you generate apparent wind and can stay going through the lulls pumping the board and the foil. I would only choose the wing over the kitefoil in light winds if it’s offshore conditions. Then there will always be a gust to catch. You just gotta wait for it. I can’t match the windfoilers who are on much bigger boards and 9m sails, but I can get close.
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Ok, lets start this.
Im still quite noob at this, so with the gong 7m and the moses 873+gong 6.6 i can start at around 12 knots in flat water consistently, so still very far away from my lightwind ideal for this, which would be 5-6 knots like the windfoilers can do on their race setup.
Opinions?